Sky News AM Agenda Transcript, Wednesday 21 January 2015

Kieran Gilbert: This is AM Agenda. With me now: Labor frontbencher Amanda Rishworth and also the Parliamentary Secretary for Communications Paul Fletcher. Good morning to you both. Amanda, first to you on this report in the Australian Newspaper suggesting the Governments’ willing to compromise further on the issue of higher education reform and not go ahead with those 20% cuts in terms of university funding. That would make their proposals on higher education more palatable wouldn’t it?

AR: Well look, what the proposals still do is leave the door open for hundred-thousand dollar degrees for students attending university because what the proposal still does is allow the universities to choose to charge what they want, and what we do know is that Joe Hockey has said that he will make savings from higher education, so what we know is likely to happen is that if these changes were to get through, then there would be cuts to education in terms of funding down the line. Labor stands opposed to allowing universities to charge what they want because we believe young people should get the opportunity to go to university.

KG: Paul Fletcher, Dio Wang of the Palmer party, while Amanda Rishworth is obviously not budging at - Labor, not budging despite this apparent compromise from the government, the Palmer party looks like it might. Dio Wang, the Palmer senator says that this bill, this proposal, would make that bill more attractive.

PF: Well Kieran the key point is that the higher education system sector is absolutely vital to Australia’s Productivity and competitiveness and to future opportunities for Australians under our package some eighty-thousand additional Australians by 2018 will be in a position to have commonwealth assistance for their places. Now Labor knows that the present system is unsustainable; the higher education sector, the Universities Australia and across the sector support the package that Minister Christopher Pyne has been taking forward. Now what minister has signalled very clearly is a willingness to negotiate in the amended version of the bill that he re-introduced in December. He took account of a number of measures that had been suggested by crossbench senators for example a five year pause in the indexation of HECS for primary carers, so there’s a very clear signal at every stage that the government and minister Pyne in particular is willing to engage constructive with senators, but this is a vital package to provide additional funding into the universities sector which is so important to our competitiveness as a nation. You look at great Australian companies like Cochlear for example, that company is based upon revenue of 900 million dollars a year; a world leader in hearing implants based upon developed, researched at Melbourne University in the sixties. So the university system is critical to our prosperity, we must have it sustained and ongoing.

KG: In terms of the Labor criticism here, Labor is saying universities are going to introduce hundred thousand dollar degrees, but if this compromise does go ahead, and the government doesn't reduce funding by 20%, doesn't the Labor scare campaign look a bit far-fetched as if universities would be pursuing those enormous fee rises is their current stay in place?

AR: Well look, under Christopher Pine’s proposal, the only cap on university fees for domestic students is that of international students, and we have seen the fees for international students go into significant amounts, including up to a hundred thousand dollars, indeed the University of Western Australia has announced their fee schedule, and if you want to become a lawyer then it’s going to cost you approximately ninety-five thousand dollars and if you want to be a doctor it’s over a hundred thousand dollars. So we’re not talking a scare campaign, we’re talking reality. What we know is that universities that have the market power will put their fees up as much as they can, and that will price many students out of the market. Now it’s not going to price out all students out of the market, but it’s going to price some of our best and brightest, and discourages them from getting a university degree. So if we want to have a sector with a human capacity that is able to the job, then we need to that our best and brightest get into university.

KG: Paul Fletcher is this important for the Government to gain some momentum, some political to start this year given there have been a couple of difficulties elsewhere and certainly on health policy?

PF: Kieran, it’s important for Australia that we have a vibrant and successful growing university system. I just want to make a point higher contribution system, HECS, will remain, and that will mean that people are not paying up-front, and of course there’s no requirement to pay until you are earning a decent wage, around fifty-thousand dollars a year, but I also want to make a point; Amanda keeps coming back to this scare campaign- let’s take a look at what Maxine McKewen, former Labor Parliamentary Secretary has had to say in the last couple of days, and she’s effectively made the point that Labor needs to engage constructively on the future of this vital sector and at the moment Labor refuse engage constructively.

KG: Okay let’s move on, I want to ask you both about the Manus Island situation. Paul Fletcher, Fairfax says 20 asylum seekers were found with weapons and petrol after raids at that facility according to a ‘well-placed source’. This remains a volatile situation there, on Manus Island, are we heading to another situation like the incident that saw Raza Barati lose his life?

PF: Well look, as Immigration Minister Dutton has said, first of all, he’s congratulated both the Papua New Guinea Government and the contractors involved in running the facility Transfield in terms of the way it’s being managed and security and order has been restored. He’s made the very strong point that people in that facility are not going to be able to come to Australia and no attempt to attempt to contest to the rules that apply to the operation of that facility are going to change that. He’s also made the point that the disobedience and the disorder that we have seen there is a factor that has compromised the availability of food and water for some within the facility which is one reason for action being taken. He has further made the point that we have understood the lessons from the incident last year that is obviously important in learning from that in the future.

KG: Amanda Rishworth is the problem that it’s a jurisdictional issue; Australia doesn’t have sovereignty over this centre, it’s a pea on PNG land, and it’s a structural flaw from a process that was established under the Rudd Government. Did Rudd rush this through and therefore leave a situation where while the government might like to deal with this more effectively they can’t because it’s on PNG soil?

AR: Well not at all, and I have to say quite frankly that what we’ve seen from the minister is no details whatsoever, and we are concerned about the heightened tensions on the Manus Island centre which is an Australian Run centre, and yet we haven’t seen anything from the minister. Indeed he has not been transparent, he has not been open with the Australian people, and quite frankly we don’t even know if he’s been in contact in any great depth with his PNG counterpart so quite frankly the minister needs to be more open with the Australian people. He can ensure the safety on Manus Island and with the Australian people-

KG: -But how can he ensure it when while it’s an Australian run centre it’s on PNG authorities who have the end say; It’s on Manus Island , this was Labor’s approach that created this situation.

AR: Well we haven’t heard anything from the minister about how he’s co-operating with PNG authorities, how often he’s talking with PNG authorities and how they’re working together. There’s been no detail whatsoever about what’s happening with the operation and so we’ve heard nothing and the Australian people have been able to have the same facts in front of them. Instead we are relying on un-named media sources in reports. The minister needs to give the Australian people a lot more, be transparent, not keep ducking and weaving, and ensure he is doing everything he can and everything that the government is committed to reducing tensions so we don’t see a horrific tragedy like we saw almost twelve months ago.

KG: Paul Fletcher the Government keeps saying the Asylum seekers won’t, or refugees when they’re found to be refugees, as many of them have been, that they won’t resettle here, the issue is that they now want, according to the advocates that they want to be integrated into the UN system; they don’t necessarily want to come here, they just don’t want to end up in PNG that’s the problem here, they want to be handled by the UN.

PF: Firstly just let me make a point: the minister was speaking in the made yesterday about these issues and so the suggestion that he’s not been open and transparent I think doesn’t square with the facts but the second point I want to make is it’s obviously important that order and safety in that facility be maintained. We obviously want to ensure that those detained in that facility have personal safety and security; have proper access to food and water, have access to medical treatment and so on, and that’s one of the reasons that the minister congratulated the Papua New Guinea authorities and Transfield for acting to restore order, but the key point here is that we have a set of obligations under international law, which of course we meet, but at the same time we came to government with a commitment to stop the boats and to stop hundreds of people drowning at sea, as happened under Labor, and this facility and it’s orderly management is part of that policy.

KG: We’re almost out of time but on this issue, the Asylum Seekers want to end up in the UN system, they’re not saying they don’t want to come here now they end up under the UN umbrella, so I just don’t see how these protests end if that’s the end outcome they want- they don’t want to be resettled in PNG.

PF: Well we are committed to the maintenance of order and safety and security within that facility.

KG: Okay well that’s it, we’re out of time Paul Fletcher, Amanda Rishworth, have a good day, appreciate it, thanks. A quick break on AM agenda, back in a moment.