TRANSCRIPT - ABC Afternoon Briefing with Greg Jennett

PAUL FLETCHER MP

Shadow Minister for Science and the Arts

Shadow Minister for Government Services and the Digital Economy

Manager of Opposition Business in the House

TRANSCRIPT

ABC Afternoon Briefing 

21 November 2024

Greg Jennett: Well, Bill Shorten's opposite number on government services is Paul Fletcher. He's also a regular on this program and Manager of Opposition Business in the House. Paul Fletcher's back with us in the studio now. Paul, good to see you again. Why don't we start with Bill shorten? And I really don't want to sour the genial tone of his farewell, but reflecting on his recent achievements this morning, I'm sure you'd be aware, Bill Shorten said when people ring up Centrelink or Medicare, we're answering the phones quicker. We're getting payments out to people quicker. We've reduced the stockpile of outstanding payments. Only a short time after that you've issued a media release announcing that Senate colleagues are going to recall Services Australia to answer for their performance. Are you saying Bill Shorten's statement today wasn't true? 

Paul Fletcher: Bill gave a great speech. Bill's been a great warrior for the Labor Party. When you look at Bill's record, what he's done with Services Australia is it now takes on average almost 50 minutes if you call the older Australians line before you get an answer. Under us, it took a bit over 20 minutes. If you apply for the Age Pension under us, it was taking 35 days. It now takes 60 days. Yet the number of people employed has gone from 27,500 to nearly 33,000. Bill Shorten has spent a lot of taxpayers’ money very enthusiastically over his 17 years in the parliament. Look, he's been a great warrior for the Labor cause. But Services Australia if you look at what he's actually achieved in two and a half years, he's spent more money and the service he's delivered has got worse. 

Greg Jennett: But if you're doing higher levels of activity, more transactions, more inquiries, then your wait times would blow out. 

Paul Fletcher: And that's not actually true either. When you look at the numbers, customer demand has actually fallen between 21-22 and 23-24. So, you know, Bill's had a range of standard reasons he's given. But it's not true that customer demand has gone up. It's gone down. It's not true that call hold times have improved. They've got worse. And frankly, it's taken them longer to process key issues or key products like when you apply for the Age Pension. 

Greg Jennett: All right. Let's move on to the Future Fund. I'm sure you had the opportunity to hear some of what Josh Wilson said before you and Angus Taylor. Yes. he has promised to rescind this investment mandate if given the opportunity to. What's so offensive about it, if the Fund is already investing by its own choice in those three national priority areas?

Paul Fletcher: Look, this is a fundamental break from a bipartisan commitment for over 20 years to building up the Future Fund, which was a Howard government initiative. Now, at about $230 billion, it's achieved a return, I believe, of, on average, about 7% a year. The Future Fund Board of Guardians has had a focus on delivering the best possible returns. That's what the focus should stay on. This is code for Labor wanting to get into the piggy bank, get money to spend on particular objectives like housing or like, climate change, emissions reduction, and to be able to use that money in place of money that would otherwise be on Budget spending. So it's very bad. It's a fundamental change. And it is frankly, coming at the cost of future generations, because the whole purpose of the Future Fund is to save money over time, so that obligations that otherwise would have to be paid by future generations are already provided for.

Greg Jennett: If you were the Government of Australia in May or June of next year, would you be tempted to ask the Fund to examine putting money into nuclear reactors? 

Paul Fletcher: We've been very clear we will be maintaining the position that the Future Fund has applied for well over 20 years. It has an objective to maximise returns and to build the Fund. It's now at $230 billion. We don't see any case for change. And this is a very serious break in what's been a bipartisan position. And this is actually this is pretty serious stuff. When a government is violating fundamental economic principles in this way, breaking into the piggy bank to find more cash because they've been spending so in such an ill disciplined way. 

Greg Jennett: All right. Let's move on to social media ban. It does appear from all the comments coming from your side, that you'll lock on with the government and accelerate its passage through the Senate next week. I wonder what the haste is. Yes, it has been a Coalition priority for quite some time now, but we have three or in many cases really just one day of Senate scrutiny being applied. Why so? 

Paul Fletcher: Look, the Coalition has a very strong record of working to improve online safety for children and all Australians. We established the eSafety Commissioner. We passed the tough new Online Safety Act in 2021 when I was Minister for Communications. David Coleman, now a Shadow Communications Minister, has been a very strong and effective advocate. And Peter Dutton, in June of this year committed that if the Coalition came to government, we would within 100 days legislate age limits so that children under 16 would not be able to get access to social media. Now, we welcome the fact that the government has come on board, has followed our lead and is committed to deliver this. We think it's important. We think we need to move as quickly as possible. And we've made it clear. And David made it clear in the chamber today, the Coalition will support moves to get this legislated next week. 

Greg Jennett: You're placing a lot of trust in their drafting processes and their preparatory work, though, aren't you? What if they've made a mistake? How is that going to be picked up? One day of Senate scrutiny and probably less than one day of debate.

Paul Fletcher: Let's focus on getting the legislation in place, requiring the social media platforms to use age verification technology. It's already used commercially in a number of places. They have the technology. It can be done. We agree with the approach in the legislation that it's about using reasonable measures rather than mandating exactly what tools can be used. But there are very effective technology tools that can now be used. And that's one of the things that's changed, frankly, over the 15 years or so that I personally have been involved in online safety issues, going back to 2010, when I was a very newly arrived backbencher. I've worked on these issues over a long time. I think this is the right time to be doing this, and the Coalition welcomes the fact that the Albanese Labor government has followed our lead and is committed to get this done. 

Greg Jennett: Do you think that the X platform is going to comply with this under its current owner? 

Paul Fletcher: It's a very clear principle that we demonstrated and made stick. For example, when we legislated the News Media Bargaining Code in the face of scepticism from some that if you do business in Australia, you need to comply with the laws of Australia, that that's the case whether you're a small business or whether you're a global social media platform. And we demonstrated that the platforms will comply with the Australian law if it's well drafted and rigorously enforced. 

Greg Jennett: All right. I should just get one response from you to a question. Well, some reporting in the Sydney Morning Herald and a question that Jason Clare was asked in the House today. Foreign student caps. The Coalition is going to come up with its own system. But the reporting says that Sarah Henderson, your education spokeswoman, attended a function with migration agents and private education colleges before you arrived at this position. Was that, Paul Fletcher, consultation or lobbying that event? Have you established that?

Paul Fletcher: I think Sarah has given a pretty clear explanation, but this is a diversionary tactic by Jason Clare, because the fact is the legislation that he's introduced would allow at least half the G8 universities to increase their number of foreign students in 2025. That's why we've said we're not going to support it, because it's not going to be effective. The number of foreign students, 474,000, in 2022, today, around 800,000. It's increased dramatically. We are not persuaded that these measures are going to work. We absolutely are committed to getting immigration numbers under control. And if we come to government, we'll have a clear plan to do that.

Greg Jennett: More I could ask on that, but I think we've covered our ground pretty well today. Paul Fletcher, thanks so much. At the end of a hectic sitting week.

Paul Fletcher: Thanks, Greg.