ABC Lateline Friday Forum, April 11 2014

EMMA ALBERICI, PRESENTER: The week began with the Labor Party trounced at the polls in Western Australia. Days later the hits continued when the former foreign minister published his diaries revealing intimate details about his personal life and exposing the former government's confidential cabinet processes to public scrutiny.

Meanwhile, the Government's two free-trade agreements are receiving wide acclaim with reports from China also looking positive.

Tonight's political forum matched the Government's parliamentary secretary to the Minister for Communications, Paul Fletcher, with Labor's Ed Husic who is the shadow parliamentary secretary to the Opposition's Treasury spokesman.

Gentlemen, welcome.

PAUL FLETCHER, PARLIAMENTARY SECRETARY TO THE MINISTER FOR COMMUNICATIONS: Good evening.

ED HUSIC, PARLY SEC TO THE SHADOW TREASURER: Good evening.

EMMA ALBERICI: Bob Carr has published his diaries. Do some of those musings by the former foreign minister put the country's foreign relationships at risk, Paul Fletcher?

PAUL FLETCHER: Well I think they potentially put the former foreign minister at risk of ridicule when he seemed to be complaining about the fact that he only got the cashmere jammies in first class and not the silk ones and the kind of degree of luxury he seemed to take for granted as attended upon his office.

Really I think showed a bit of a disconnect between the people he's supposed to have been there to serve and the kind of mindset that he seemed to have adopted.

And certainly I think people who had met with him, people from other nations, in having discussions that they would have assumed were confidential might well be quite alarmed at some of the things he disclosed.

EMMA ALBERICI: Ed Husic, has Bob Carr put his own interests, that is to sell lots of books, ahead of the national interest?

ED HUSIC: As he explained there have been a lot of when you look at people in similar positions overseas who put out their memoirs and made comments in relation to their time in office, I mean I sort of reflecting on this in the last 24 hours that if he'd written simply a book that had focused on foreign affairs issue and it had been a weighty tome with facts and detail and put forward various arguments I don't think we'd be having this discussion.

I actually think it won't affect foreign relations. It might even bring people closer to Australia when they see all the interesting and revelations and all the talk about exercise and so forth. I mean he has taken the Mickey out of himself big time in the book as well and I think a lot of people have been jumping up and down about nothing.

EMMA ALBERICI: Before we move on from this issue, I just wanted to ask you, Ed Husic, did the Jewish lobby have too much influence over the Gillard Government?

ED HUSIC: I don't believe so. I think when I look at the way in which, I reflect on the way in which we arrived at the position that we did with respect to Palestine and entry to the UN and our vote on that, you know, we had all sides were actually able to, people with all views on this matter were able to express them and also try and bring those together and get a position within caucus on it.

Initially, though, I mean I had misgivings about the way in which it looked like the decision was going to be made. That was that it would be, it seemed like it was going to be a binding vote and I expressed a fairly firm view, as did others, that we weren't prepared to accept that because we thought the better policy outcome was to have everyone be able to express and represent the views of their constituencies.

And so, we did go through that process and that's where we reached in the end. But there's been a lot of talk about this in the last 24 hours. I think a good sign of a democracy is that you have strong views that are expressed but ultimately you try to reach the, you know, the accommodation and consensus point as far as conceivably possible.

EMMA ALBERICI: Let's move on. The Prime Minister is in China on a roadshow with 600 business people, state premiers, Paul Fletcher, is he going to come back with a free trade agreement with Beijing?

PAUL FLETCHER: Well, what the Prime Minister has said, what the Minister for Trade has said is that is something that we want to work towards. That will take some time but we are focused on it.

The previous Government failed to achieve trade agreements with any of China, Japan or Korea. We've got on with the job within six months we're in a position to say one signed, one agreed and we're hard at work on the third and that's because what the Abbott Government is focused on is serving the people who elected us and delivering outcomes, in this case the outcome we're looking for is better trade relationships, opening up markets and creating jobs and more opportunities for Australians.

ED HUSIC: And that's what it's all about, being able to get the trophy effect. You know, be able to rattle off that we did these trade deals with Japan and Korea.

PAUL FLETCHER: Ed, Ed, you...

ED HUSIC: Hang on a second, I didn't interrupt you while you were going on.

PAUL FLETCHER: But I didn't say something quite as ridiculous as you just said.

ED HUSIC: I'll say to you why I think it's a trophy effect is I'm sure we'll get a deal with China because they're racing to get one because they want to be able to rattle off that they've done it.

Let's look at the Japan free trade agreement, for instance. What Paul didn't say to you is all the discomfort that's been expressed by rice growers, in fact one quote in the 'Financial Review' saying that the deal was a bloody disgrace, his words not mine, the sugar cane... hang on a second, I know this is uncomfortable but let's look... wait on a second. At least have some courtesy to listen to another side of an argument while you've been rattling it off.

PAUL FLETCHER: Let's look at beef, for example.

ED HUSIC: I'm also looking at for example dairy farmers who are unhappy about it and I've mentioned rice growers and sugar cane growers and even back benchers who represent those growers upset about it as well. And so if the question I'd like to ask is where's Barnaby?

Because if we had put this deal up in Government and he had had all those constituencies upset, where's Barnaby Joyce representing their interests because it's clear that there is a great deal of discomfort about the failure of this deal to deliver and some of the cases

PAUL FLETCHER: The premise of what you're saying is wrong.

ED HUSIC: You can say that from Hornsby. Why don't you go out into rural Australia where they're actually saying these things and it's being repeated in the newspapers.

PAUL FLETCHER: I've been in rural Australia for the last two days. I was in Rockhampton yesterday, I was in Maryborough yesterday. These deals are good news for Australian agriculture, for canning.

ED HUSIC: Eighteen years to bring some of those tariffs down. Come on, 18 years.

EMMA ALBERICI: It's better than what the US has managed to achieve.

PAUL FLETCHER: After a Labor Government for six years failed to get these deals.

ED HUSIC: And this is it, this is all about getting a trophy effect.

PAUL FLETCHER: Let's look at beef. Beef, the tariffs are going to come down by over 50 per cent.

ED HUSIC: What did the NFF say about that?

PAUL FLETCHER: It's been widely welcomed by those in the agricultural sector. Half of that reduction in beef is going to come down in two years. So this is a significant benefit for the beef industry. It's a significant benefit for a range of agricultural exporters.

ED HUSIC: You've been having too much of the sugar that's stockpiling that won't get sold on this trade deal.

EMMA ALBERICI: Hold on a moment. It is a little churlish for Labor to criticise the Government when you did have six years to conclude the agreement yourselves.

ED HUSIC: And I certainly would never apologise for the fact that I would not sign up to a deal for the sake of signing up to the deal if I thought our interests weren't being enhanced by that deal.

EMMA ALBERICI: But doesn't that enhance our interests? Beef producers

ED HUSIC: And no one should. 18 years lets pop a champagne cork over that.

PAUL FLETCHER: There's two potential explanations of what's going on here. Explanation number one is that Labor said oh, we're going to hold out

ED HUSIC: You do like hearing the sound of your own voice and interrupting all the time.

PAUL FLETCHER: We're going to hold out for a perfect deal. Explanation number two, is when it came to trade as in so many areas, an incompetent government failed to get on with the job.

ED HUSIC: Garbage, garbage, you would rather hold out for a dud deal and Barnaby Joyce is absolutely mute on this issue where his own people are being sold out by the Liberal side of the Coalition.

PAUL FLETCHER: You've failed to get, you've failed to get the deal, you've failed to get with Japan, you've failed to get the deal with China, you've failed to get the deal with Korea.

And you can just look across the Tasman at New Zealand and see how well they've done out of the free trade agreement with China. Good luck to them, they're doing well, but we need to be in that market capturing those opportunities. That's why Tony Abbott is in China. That's why Andrew Robb is in China.

ED HUSIC: I'd rather advance Australia's interests than advance a trophy interest.

PAUL FLETCHER: Working on these opportunities.

EMMA ALBERICI: Let's agree to disagree on that score. On the NBN, because we are going to run out of time.

ED HUSIC: That will be less contentious.

EMMA ALBERICI: Paul Fletcher, will the Coalition's version be able to keep up with advances in technology over the next 20 years?

PAUL FLETCHER: Absolutely. The Coalition is delivering, will deliver a national broadband network involving a mix of fibre to the premises, fibre to the node and cable. We will roll out significantly more quickly than Labor ever managed to achieve.

ED HUSIC: It was two years and you failed to keep your own promise.

PAUL FLETCHER: The number of premises passed at the election 200,000, already 340,000 in terms of greenfields - brownfields fibre, I should say. And most importantly getting competent people on the board. There were no people with telecommunication s experience on the NBN board.

EMMA ALBERICI: But to be fair, Paul Fletcher, if you've got telecommunications experience in this country doesn't necessarily augur well for what's happening into the future because what's happened 10 years ago is going to be vastly different to what happened in the next 10 years, isn't it?

PAUL FLETCHER: People with experience, we've found that...

EMMA ALBERICI: When you were in the telecommunications business for eight years in Optus and can you say that that translates, that experience translates to what's happening in the modern day?

PAUL FLETCHER: I will tell you that in the telecommunications industry one of the big challenges is how you invest to take account of precisely that point, the technology moves so quickly. And that's why we've got experienced telecommunications sector out there now including Bill Morrow, former chief executive of Vodafone Australia, and Vodafone businesses around the world, very experienced executive because that issue about how we invest capital to get the best result is critical.

ED HUSIC: They don't need infrastructure people because they're not doing a build. All they have done since they have come in is complain and condemn and start reviews, you know. There should be less condemnation, more action by these guys. They should stop complaining and start building.

But all they've done is they've picked up the blueprint, they've punched a hole through it, lifted it up and said we can't build this. And what are they building in their place?

They will retain more copper, they will use HSC that clogs up when more and more people use it and more importantly, this week, this time last year they promised that they would have a minimum download speeds of 25 megabits per second by 2016 and by December they ditched that promise.

EMMA ALBERICI: Google fibre is actively delivering one gigabit of upload and download speeds to 40 cities in the US within the next three years.

PAUL FLETCHER: No, no, three at the moment.

ED HUSIC: That Malcolm Turnbull said last night wasn't happening on this show.

PAUL FLETCHER: No, there are three at the moment.

EMMA ALBERICI: No, no, Google fibre says within three years they will have 40.

PAUL FLETCHER: Yeah right now it's three - it's Austin, Texas...

EMMA ALBERICI: No but I'm telling you what their aspiration is versus the Coalition's aspiration in this country. What you're offering is 10 times less than that in terms of speed.

PAUL FLETCHER: What we're offering speeds much faster than today.

ED HUSIC: What a cracking deal!

EMMA ALBERICI: I'd like to quote you the Google chief financial officer Patrick Pichette who recently said that his firm is working to boost Internet speeds 1,000 fold because "that's where the world is going." Are you sure Australia's not going to be left behind?

PAUL FLETCHER: I'm confident that the Coalition's plan for the NBN will be much more cost effective, it will be rolled out much more quickly, will give us speeds that are a stepped change compared to what people get today - 50 megabits per second.

EMMA ALBERICI: And keep up with the rest of the world?

PAUL FLETCHER: Yes, we will be absolutely able to flexibly respond, yes.

EMMA ALBERICI: And a final word from you, Ed Husic.

ED HUSIC: I visited Kansas earlier this year, seeing in there the optimism that will come from having a solid network in place attracting new business in that part of the US in Kansas City.

EMMA ALBERICI: Kansas City has one gigabit.

ED HUSIC: And where they are starting to do that, for example, Austin, other telcos are trying now to match them like AT and T are trying to match them in terms of the speeds. In the States they've had 100 megabits per second for ages and are laughing at us, that we've got a debate about whether or not we'll get 25 and this side of politics saying you don't need one gig when the US is gearing up one gigabit per second right now in various parts of the country.

What the other side of politics is doing is condemning us to slower speeds but importantly, crippling the emergence of our own digital economy here because we do not have solid infrastructure in place. They complain, they whine, they don't build and we'll be poorer for it.

EMMA ALBERICI: We've run out of time. I thank you both very much for coming for us this evening.

PAUL FLETCHER: Thank you very much.

ED HUSIC: Thank you.

ENDS