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MANAGER OF OPPOSITION BUSINESS - TRANSCRIPT - ABC RN WITH PATRICIA KARVELAS
ABC RN WITH PATRICIA KARVELAS
6 APRIL 2023
E&OE
Subject/s: The Voice
PATRICIA KARVELAS: Staying on this announcement from the Liberals that they will oppose the Voice to Parliament, we're joined by Paul Fletcher, Manager of Opposition Business. Paul Fletcher. Welcome.
PAUL FLETCHER: Good to be with you, Patricia.
KARVELAS: Noel Pearson just labelled the Liberals opposition to the Voice as a Judas betrayal of the country, he said Peter Dutton was an undertaker preparing to bury Uluru. What's your response to those very strong words?
FLETCHER: Well, we've taken a decision that we believe is in the national interest and in the interests of Indigenous Australians, we're very clear that we support the constitutional recognition of Indigenous Australians and we support a legislated establishment of regional and local voices as was...
KARVELAS: OK. Let me get in there the the on this acknowledgement saying that you want recognition, and Indigenous people have said they don't want just recognition they don’t want that, so you want to offer something that the very people you seek to reconcile with are saying they don't want.
FLETCHER: Again, we support the constitutional recognition of Indigenous Australians and we support the legislated establishment of regional and local voices, the regional and local voices that were recommended in the Calma Langton report, and that's been a consistent part of our position in our work on this over many years. Now the Prime Minister has not given any clarity about regional and local voices. But it's important that we hear from Indigenous Australians and local communities about issues about health facilities or social services matters. The cashless debit card, for example, when I was Social Services minister visiting community communities like the gold fields in WA or Ceduna in South Australia. I met with many senior Aboriginals, men and women who expressed their support for the cashless debit card. What we've now seen in Canberra from this Labor government is a decision to abolish that, and we're already seeing the effects on the ground in terms of social disharmony.
KARVELAS: Let me just take you though to the substance. So I put to you and you didn't really answer on recognition that Indigenous people don't want it, does it? Doesn't it worry you that Indigenous people have said that's not enough?
FLETCHER: What we support is the constitutional recognition of Indigenous Australians. That's an important gesture that's very important. But what we also support is practical outcomes for Indigenous Australians.
KARVELAS: Yeah, in the regional and local bodies, which you think should be legislated and we know what happens with legislation. I mean, I was there when ATSIC was abolished. You just can legislation can abolish it. Isn't that the risk?
FLETCHER: It's very clear that there's going to be legislation involved in setting up a Voice under whatever model is proposed. That's pretty clear from...
KARVELAS: No, but if it's enshrined in the Constitution, you can't just abolish.
FLETCHER: From what the Prime Minister has said, but what the Prime Minister has not given us is the details of how the legislation will work and what we also know is that the Prime Minister is making claims, for example, about the range of matters. On which the Voice on his model would have the capacity to make representations which is not an accurate interpretation of the wording he's proposed. As our spokesman Julian Leeser said in his very good speech to National Press Club on Monday, we have worked for and consistently supported a Voice, but we're now in a position where the Prime Minister has chosen wording without adequate consultation. He put out the wording first at the Garma festival. He's put up to the public when changes to that, we know that there are significant constitutional concerns. We know the Attorney General tried to get the wording changed and the Prime Minister overruled that.
KARVELAS: OK.
FLETCHER: … and we've been asking for the Solicitor General's report. We've been asking for the details for months, the Prime Minister has refused to provide the details had changed. The Constitution has very significant consequences for all Australians. The Indigenous Australians and non Indigenous Australians.
KARVELAS: OK. Just. OK. Just a final question before I let you go. Why has the Liberal front bench been forced to fall into line in a binding position? You didn't do that with the Republic. You didn't do that with same sex marriage. Why?
FLETCHER: We've taken a decision, a Shadow Cabinet decision, and that's the position that we've arrived at. Of course, members of the Liberal Party, other than those who have a particular front bench responsibilities, are always free to exercise a conscience vote. Can I make the point, though, that we've said we will support the bill? To authorise the referendum to proceed. And so...
KARVELAS: Hmm. You have? Yep. Just final question. Paul Fletcher before. I do let you go if if it's a yes vote, if it's successful. Is Peter Dutton's leadership over?
FLETCHER: Look this this is not an issue about political personalities. This is an issue about what is best for Indigenous Australians and for all Australians and for addressing Indigenous difficulties.
KARVELAS: Absolutely. But he is. He's now actively campaigning as opposition leader. It's a big call, which you wouldn't contest. It's a big call. So if it gets up. Is his leadership over. And would you put your hand up?
FLETCHER: Patricia, this is this is not about individual politicians. This is about the welfare and the best possible outcomes for Indigenous Australians. We are passionately committed because I think what is much more what is much more important, quite frankly...
KARVELAS: You haven't answered my question. Would his leadership be over?
FLETCHER: … Patricia is the best possible outcomes for Indigenous Australians and for all Australians. That's been the prism through which we've arrived at our decision and this is based upon a position of wanting the best outcome for Indigenous Australians, the best outcome for all Australians.
KARVELAS: OK.
FLETCHER: And getting practical results. It's a shame that the Prime Minister has gone off in the direction that he has. But we're clear we support constitutional recognition of Indigenous Australians and we support the legislators establishment of regional and local voices.
KARVELAS: Paul Fletcher, thanks for joining us this morning.
FLETCHER: Thanks, Patricia.
KARVELAS: That's the Manager of Opposition Business, Paul Fletcher.
